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Status Of Your Owl


Nightowl >8#
 

Hey all,

Sorry I've not been here lately, but I have not forgotten you. I've been swirling in the midst of finding photographs, pulling together the Celebration of Life service and contacting people about my Mom's memorial on January 25th.

I want to ask some questions of you all.

Can anyone confirm that any bad content has come through into their group?
Is there more spam or less spam?
Has Verizon restored any of our moderation controls?
Have groups been running slow, or not working at all?

It's beginning to look like I need to do another full media blitz but I probably won't be able to do that until either later tonight, or tomorrow during our predicted ICE STORM, provided we keep our power.

I also have to type up the Eulogy that my sister put together and just dropped off here. And tonight, we are all going up together to tell my 96 year old Dad that his wife is gone. Not looking forward to that, but it's something we have to do.

So everyone put out some feelers, find out how bad or worse the Yahoo Groups situation has gotten, and bring me back into the loop ok?

Thanks,

Brenda
Nightowl >8#


David Halfpenny
 

Nightowl,

All my Yahoo Groups are working normally by email-only.

No Spam or other bad content.

During the past month, only a couple of people have asked why they can’t get into the Website.

The Moderator controls remain incomplete, the one making me most anxious being the inability to Moderate people who aren’t already Moderated.

No sign of Groups running slow.

David 
(Mix of UK and US groups)

 
On 16 Jan 2020, at 21:50, Nightowl >8# <featheredleader@...> wrote:

Hey all,

Sorry I've not been here lately, but I have not forgotten you.  I've been swirling in the midst of finding photographs, pulling together the Celebration of Life service and contacting people about my Mom's memorial on January 25th.

I want to ask some questions of you all.

Can anyone confirm that any bad content has come through into their group?
Is there more spam or less spam?
Has Verizon restored any of our moderation controls?
Have groups been running slow, or not working at all?

It's beginning to look like I need to do another full media blitz but I probably won't be able to do that until either later tonight, or tomorrow during our predicted ICE STORM, provided we keep our power.

I also have to type up the Eulogy that my sister put together and just dropped off here. And tonight, we are all going up together to tell my 96 year old Dad that his wife is gone.  Not looking forward to that, but it's something we have to do.

So everyone put out some feelers, find out how bad or worse the Yahoo Groups situation has gotten, and bring me back into the loop ok?

Thanks,

Brenda
Nightowl >8#






Erikag59
 

Groups that were moderated are still moderated (by email only).

Groups that happened to be unmoderated when Yahoo took away the controls cannot be made moderated.

In active unmoderated groups, I have seen:

* Content that is somewhat off-topic.

* Blank replies.

* Unsubscribe requests.

I have not seen any outright spam except in a group that was abandoned for years.

--Erik


 
On 16 Jan 2020, at 21:50, Nightowl >8# <featheredleader@...> wrote:


Can anyone confirm that any bad content has come through into their group?
Is there more spam or less spam?
Has Verizon restored any of our moderation controls?
Have groups been running slow, or not working at all?


Andy
 

I'm new here (was in the old Y!G, just joined this one), so not sure if my reply will be appropriate.

I am sorry about what's happened on your end.

In one of my Yahoo!Groups, the spam started soon after Yahoo's December changes.  We had years of virtually no spam (and dozens of good messages daily), but when Yahoo changed the settings, first-time message moderation vanished, and now the spam goes through unchecked.  I think we were targeted too, by someone who knew that Yahoo groups are vulnerable now.  Now there is no way to fully stop it except to delete the group.  I did change a setting; hopefully that will help.  Fortunately, that group migrated to Groups.io, so the old group on Yahoo is not really needed, except as a place-holder to point people to the new site.  (New people are still joining the old group!)

In a few other groups where I am a member (not a moderator), there has been a sudden rash of annoying messages.  One group has hundreds of "Unsubscribe me" messages, from people who can't stand all the other "Unsubscribe me" messages.  Heh!  Lots of yelling -- it's a mess.

Another group started getting daily spam this week, and everyone is complaining about that.

Many other groups are unaffected so far.  I guess it depends on whether or not they have been visited by people who send spam.

One thing that puzzles me is that Yahoo left members with no way to post a message from the group's webpage.  Many members are "No Email" so they access the group ONLY from the webpage.

Andy



Cindy T
 

One of my groups that was still working has suddenly changed from digest to individual emails.   Trying to change it back, the digest option was no longer there.  It was either lots of individual Emails or No Email.


kr402
 

I think that digest is no longer available since it is now emails only, no group posts.
Which makes no sense to offer 'no email'.

On Friday, January 17, 2020, 10:27 AM, Cindy Tobias <cindyt@...> wrote:

One of my groups that was still working has suddenly changed from digest to individual 
emails.   Trying to change it back, the digest option was no longer there. It was either lots of individual Emails or No Email.._,_._,


 

Andy,

One thing that puzzles me is that Yahoo left members with no way to
post a message from the group's webpage.
That was intentional. Group messages are now by email only.

Many members are "No Email" so they access the group ONLY from the
webpage.
They will need to change their subscription to receive mail, or else be completely out of touch with the messages in the group.

If you change the No Email members to Individual yourself you'll probably "smoke out" any number of people who thought they'd unsubscribed years ago. They'll either be upset or will quietly unsubscribe.

Shal


 

Cindy,

Trying to change it back, the digest option was no longer there. It
was either lots of individual Emails or No Email.
Digests are still available by email command:
http://yahoogroupedia.pbworks.com/Using-Email-Commands

It is anyone's guess though how long they will continue to work. They are on the list of things that are "going away":
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/groups/SLN31010.html

One guess is that they'll stop having any content some time after the Jan 31st deadline for requesting data.

Shal


Andy
 

I wrote:

 > One thing that puzzles me is that Yahoo left members with no way to
 > post a message from the group's webpage.

Shal replied:

That was intentional. Group messages are now by email only.

Yes, I realize that.  I just don't understand it.

I kind of figured that Yahoo was trying to reduce their disk farms and data storage requirements that the old groups had, along with the cost of data maintenance.  By eliminating all File, Photo, and Message archives, they achieved that.  Of course that means all members receive messages by email only.  But eliminating the ability to post a message without sending it as an email?  That seems unnecessary.  It's just a little bit of code, which they already had.  They could have left it in place.

Of course the other possibility is that Yahoo only wants to kill off groups by making them as unpleasant as possible.

If you change the No Email members to Individual yourself you'll
probably "smoke out" any number of people who thought they'd
unsubscribed years ago. They'll either be upset or will quietly unsubscribe.

Probably most are bouncing.  I wonder if Yahoo has resumed doing anything about bouncing members.  They stopped doing that a few years ago.  One would think it's in their best interest to remove bouncing members or set them to not be sent emails anymore (which just tie up Yahoo's servers with unnecessary traffic).  I don't understand why they stopped doing that, unless it was an egg left by a disgruntled former Yahoo employee.

I see that they don't even have a Moderator selection for "Bouncing" members anymore (since December).  Not sure what that means.

Andy



 

Andy,

But eliminating the ability to post a message without sending it as an
email? That seems unnecessary. It's just a little bit of code, which
they already had. They could have left it in place.
They could have left New Topic, but most messages (at least in my groups) are replies - and there's no place to put that without keeping the messages. What I don't understand is why they decided to remove those.

Even New Topic button would have required placement on another page, as the Conversations page was dismantled altogether.

Probably most are bouncing. I wonder if Yahoo has resumed doing
anything about bouncing members.
I suspect they've done nothing about it.

I don't understand why they stopped doing that, unless it was an egg
left by a disgruntled former Yahoo employee.
Now there's a thought. I've always assumed that the mechanism broke somehow and there was no one left who could figure out how to fix it, or even understand why that might be important.

I see that they don't even have a Moderator selection for "Bouncing"
members anymore (since December). Not sure what that means.
The disappearance of the Bouncing tab is pretty strong evidence that there's no one there that understands why it is important with an email list.

I don't think it means anything else, other than making it difficult to find bouncing members. The only indication is at the bottom of each member's Edit Member pop-up dialog, where bouncing members have a line of the form:

Bouncing Status : Soft Bouncing as of Aug 29, 2011. View History

Where /View History/ is a link to the bounce history for that member.

But this means opening that pop-up for each member to find out if he/she is bouncing or not.

Shal


Steve Hayes
 

On 18 Jan 2020 at 15:10, Andy wrote:

I kind of figured that Yahoo was trying to reduce their disk farms and data
storage requirements that the old groups had, along with the cost of data
maintenance. By eliminating all File, Photo, and Message archives, they
achieved that. Of course that means all members receive messages by email
only. But eliminating the ability to post a message without sending it as an
email? That seems unnecessary. It's just a little bit of code, which they
already had. They could have left it in place.
E-mail messages are held on a "store and forward" basis -- they occupy space
on the servers only until they are forwarded, then they are deleted. But
messagesd entered on the web interface remain on the server. and if they are
to be read on the web interface they and the e-mail messages have to remain
on the server too, which is what takes up the disk space.


--
Steve Hayes
E-mail: shayes@...
Blog: http://khanya.wordpress.com
Web: http://www.khanya.org.za/stevesig.htm
Phone: 083-342-3563 or 012-333-6727
Fax: 086-548-2525


David Halfpenny
 


On 19 Jan 2020, at 03:14, Shal Farley <shals2nd@...> wrote:

The disappearance of the Bouncing tab is pretty strong evidence that there's no one there that understands why it is important with an email list.

I’ve just invited a Group over to Groups.io, and fully half of the Invitations bounced, for one reason or another!
Because its members are vulnerable, though the collapse of Approval and Moderation, I’ve done the switch over in just a week. But the new group starts with only 10% of its members on board, and with 50% of them unaware that it’s happened.

All I can do is to put pointers on the old Group site:
- changing the About page to flag it all up,
- changing the Group Website field to a new site that will lead people home.

David 1/2d


Andy
 

Steve Hayes wrote:

.... But
messagesd entered on the web interface remain on the server. and if they are
to be read on the web interface they and the e-mail messages have to remain
on the server too, which is what takes up the disk space.

I am curious why you say that.  Do you work for Yahoo/Oath?

Why would they save messages on their servers simply because of the method by which they were delivered to Yahoo?

Isn't a message that was typed at their web interface, just the same as an incoming email message that was received by their servers?  Either type of message would be held in a "store and forward" basis, sent to the email list recipients and then discarded, wouldn't they?

Shal makes a good point that you can't actually "reply" unless you have a message to reply to.  I hadn't thought of that.

Andy



 

PMFJI

I just want to say thanks to everyone - Brenda, Shal, Steve, et al

This [mmsanctuary] seems to be the only site that I can go to see what's going on with YGs.
For that reason alone I am most thankful!

A few days ago I clicked on the "Create a Group" link and was kind of surprised I can at least still create a group:
http://j.mp/rp-taal is the shortcut to it.
All I have done since then is update the "Description" now and then for my own purpose and those who might find some use for the links embedded in the site.
If the topic is worth discussing, can someone please start a new thread? [I mean, the Subject is now not "Status of Your Owl" and I do not want to distract more attention than I have done already.]

Thanks.
(I was born and raised in the Philippines but have been residing in the U.S. since 1985. btw, Steve [Hayes] I enjoyed my visit - albeit brief - to your blog just now.) :)


Steve Hayes
 

On 19 Jan 2020 at 9:36, Andy wrote:

Steve Hayes wrote:

.... But
messagesd entered on the web interface remain on the server. and if they are
to be read on the web interface they and the e-mail messages have to remain
on the server too, which is what takes up the disk space.
I am curious why you say that. Do you work for Yahoo/Oath?

Why would they save messages on their servers simply because of the method by
which they were delivered to Yahoo?
Because that's they way those things work.

Isn't a message that was typed at their web interface, just the same as an
incoming email message that was received by their servers? Either type of
message would be held in a "store and forward" basis, sent to the email list
recipients and then discarded, wouldn't they?
Yes.

But when you have a web interface, the message has to stay there until people
who want to read it on the web log in to read it. And that is what they have
done away with. They store incoming messages just long enough to forward them
to the list subscribers, and then delete them -- requires very little disk
space.



--
Steve Hayes
E-mail: shayes@...
Blog: http://khanya.wordpress.com
Web: http://www.khanya.org.za/stevesig.htm
Phone: 083-342-3563 or 012-333-6727
Fax: 086-548-2525


 

David,

I’ve just invited a Group over to Groups.io, and fully half of the
Invitations bounced, for one reason or another!
Depending on how and when you collected the Yahoo Group's Manage Members list you may have included addresses marked as bouncing by Yahoo as well as addresses which should have been but weren't.

But the new group starts with only 10% of its members on board, and
with 50% of them unaware that it’s happened.
If you mean the 50% that bounced the invitation from Groups.io, I don't think there's much you can do for them - most likely those address have long been disabled. Hopefully some of the people behind those addresses have signed up with other addresses.

Shal


David Halfpenny
 


On 19 Jan 2020, at 16:21, Shal Farley <shals2nd@...> wrote:

> I’ve just invited a Group over to Groups.io, and fully half of the
> Invitations bounced, for one reason or another!

 you may have included addresses marked as bouncing by Yahoo as well as addresses which should have been but weren’t.

I’m sure so, Shal.

I don't think there's much you can do for them - most likely those address have long been disabled. 

I’ve collected three types of Members List, and will spreadsheet them side by side ~ once there’s a lull. That might reveal some more working addresses.

Hopefully some of the people behind those addresses have signed up with other addresses.

Our group is a bit like an Accident & Emergency in a hospital - people generally arrive at death’s door (sometimes literally) and most of them either do die or we help them get better fairly soon. 
So as long the chronic cases can find us one way or another, it’ll work out OK.

David